Information

Identification-History

For discussions of lace history and lace identification.  You can post a photo into a comment box for a lace you want to discuss.  Bobblin lace history.  About historic lace. Kinds of lace.  Distinguish types of lace.

We can identify a piece of lace for you, but we need good detail.  At least one photo with this kind of detail is necessary.  Otherwise we are just guessing.  A shot of the whole thing is useful because that shows us the style.  Style gives us clues to date and possibly geographical origin.  But we need the detail shot to tell us how it was made.

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Latest Activity: yesterday

Examples + Resources

PHOTOS   

http://www.laceforstudy.org.uk/ 

Descriptions of several styles of lace - https://www.jeanleader.net/lacestyles/index.html

To compare needle lace, tatting and crochet, Kathleen Minniti's sampler.

My antique lace boards on Pinterest   

http://www.pinterest.com/lynxlacelady/bobbin-lace-antique/ 

http://www.pinterest.com/lynxlacelady/needle-lace-antique/ 

My collection of boards on Pinterest http://www.pinterest.com/lynxlacelady/ 

Jo Edkins lace collection online:  http://gwydir.demon.co.uk/jo/lace/collection/index.htm

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 Bobbin lace    antiquebobbinlace     bobbinlace3     Needle lace    needlelace2 

For recognizing Swedish bobbin lace:  http://elsapetersonsspetsaffar.com/

Tatting     tatting2   tatting3      

Filet lace    filetlace2    filetlace3   filet lace4    Buratto 

Sol lace   sollace2   sol lace3

Knitted lace    knittedlace2     Crochet lace        Irish crochet lace      IrishCrochet2      

TAPE LACE WITH PARTS NOT ALL BOBBIN MADE

Bobbin tape lace  bobbin tape lace 2   

Mixed tape lace-machinetape      Romanian needlepoint lace  

LACES WITH OTHER MACHINE MADE PARTS - net

Embroidery on tulle-needlerun      Embroidery on tulle-tambour        Carrickmacross  

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MACHINE LACES

This is what it takes to make a cloth stitch strip with a machine. I don't know which machine this is. https://www.facebook.com/brooklynlaceguild/videos/1496541547035682/ ;

Chemical lace   ChemicalLace2  chemical lace3     chemical lace4     

See this for a technical explanation of the chemical lace process.

Barmen machine lace        Raschel machine lace     Leavers machine

machine1 (not sure what machine)   

RESOURCES TO START LEARNING HOW TO IDENTIFY LACE

http://laceioli.ning.com/group/identification-history/page/online-resources 

http://laceioli.ning.com/group/identification-history/page/6475898:Page:1417 

http://laceioli.ning.com/group/identification-history/page/specific-pages-in-lynxlace 

IOLI.ORG'S RESOURCES

THE KOON COLLECTION

The Koon collection CD is a collection of images from the Eunice Sein Koon
Collection of Lace donated to IOLI by Ms. Koon. Ms. Koon was the editor of
Lace Craft Quarterly and a collector of lace.  It is not related to the
Minnesota collection to the best of my knowledge.  The CD is a series of
Powerpoint slides organized as the collection pieces are numbered.  There
are approximately 100 pieces of various types of lace in the Koon
collection.  Pictures from the CD could be copied and pasted into another
Powerpoint presentation, or the images could be used to request pieces of
lace from the collection for study by IOLI members.  Policy for use of this
lace is described on p. 58 of the IOLI Member Handbook. -- Jo Ann Eurell

LACE STUDY BOX

The IOLI - Internation Organization of Lace, Inc. has a study box of lace fragments that members can borrow.  

(I am searching for a link)

IOLI also has a lending library for members' use

http://www.internationalorganizationoflace.org/library1.html

http://laceioli.ning.com/group/international-organization-of-lace-inc/page/ioli-advanced-study-of-lace

A site with good photos of high quality antique laces: http://www.mendes.co.uk/antique.bobbin.lace.p.two.html ;

Discussion Forum

Normandy Lace Identification 3 Replies

Hello:I am trying to determine what exactly this is and am hoping for assistance.What I know is that the center pieces were from a wedding dress, date unknown. It was cut into pieces creating a…Continue

Started by Rosemary Houston. Last reply by Jo Edkins yesterday.

Machine, Needle or Bobbin Lace? 30 Replies

This is my first post in this group, something I'd love to find out about what type of lace this is.  It appears to be a design possibly hand woven onto a very fine filet net, or it could possibly be…Continue

Tags: filet net, bird net, hat net, square knotted net, net

Started by Jeanne B. Last reply by Jeanne B Oct 28.

Post removed 5 Replies

Post removedContinue

Started by post removed. Last reply by Georgia Seitz Sep 13.

Bedfordshire? 10 Replies

I'm new to the technical side of the lace world, but a long-time collector from charity and thrift shops. I'm having fun trying to ID and date some of my old finds. I'm wondering if some of you with…Continue

Started by Guinevere. Last reply by Lorelei Halley Administrator Aug 27.

Comment Wall

Comment

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Comment by Lorelei Halley Administrator on February 1, 2012 at 5:21pm

While searching for something else, I came across this page with some photos of antique bobbin and needle laces:

http://www.ladentelledupuy.com/index.php?page=tissutheque

Comment by Lorelei Halley Administrator on February 1, 2012 at 4:06pm

Patty

This is where Tebbs is really useful.  She uses all these deceitful names for the laces she describes how to make.  I haven't got it all straight in my head yet because the verbal descriptions are like untangling the tower of babel. 

In practical terms there are several varieties of part laces from the late 19th to early 20th century, that I've seen, that don't fit into the Brussels-Duchesse-Bruges Bloomwork continuum.

There is a kind of coarse Duchesse type lace, in terms of how the motifs are worked and their shapes, that I have several examples of on my website.  See http://lynxlace.com/bobbinlacerevivalerapart.html  #179   178   390   98   209    208   177 and possibly 123.   I have a few of these in my collection.  They are typical Duchesse in technique, but the scale is larger, worked perhaps in 100/2 linen (most good duchesse is considerably finer).  Yo Pauwels, who taught at Kantcentrum in the 1980s, was in Chicago to give us a workshop and stayed at my house.  I asked her what she thought they were.  She said "oh, we call that fine bloomwork"  fijn bloomwerk.  But it is not as coarse as Bruges bloomwork usually is and its technique is like simple duchesse, not Bruges bloomwork.

Then there is the Vieux Flandres you mention.  Please look at the same page in my website:   http://lynxlace.com/bobbinlacerevivalerapart.html   

#55   174   175   349  

But 338    166   165 are different again.  They have the coarse duchesse bobbin lace motifs, worked more openly (almost cheesecloth-like), but the odd thing is the handmade needle lace ground.

I cannot keep it straight in my head which of these is what Tebbs called "vieux flandres".  She also has other names.  I don't know which label goes with which piece.  But these are examples I've seen and handled.  I've always wondered what to call each of these types and exactly where they may have been made.  Tebbs probably has the answer, but I haven't worked it out yet.

Comment by Patty Dowden on February 1, 2012 at 1:47pm

I had an identification adventure at the Lace Museum several years ago.  A woman came in with some lace from a deceased relative that was not quite finished.  She also had a piece that needed to be repaired.

I showed her how to sew in the ends on the unfinished piece and she picked it up quite easily.  

The piece that needed a bit of repair was a puzzle to me as far as what kind of lie it was.  From it's condition, it seemed fairly old (1900 or so), and the first impression was Duchesse, but it was was TOO BIG.  The thread was too big, the parts were too big; it seemed a terrible quandary.  I couldn't tell her what it was.

Later I figured out that is was Vieux Flandre, a horror foisted off by the lace manufacturers with a fancy name implying great age.  What a shock!  While the woman was there, I kept running through the checklist in my head for Duchesse and saying yes to elements, grounds, pattern, but always came back to the sheer size of it.  

I am curious to know what other knowledgeable people know about Vieux Flandre. 

Comment by Beth Schoenberg on February 1, 2012 at 12:07am

What a great project.  Well done!

Have you shown the curator(s) at the museum the finished pieces?  I'll bet they'd love to see how the "fresh new" lace must have looked.  If they have seen your work, and/or your Bulletin article, what did they say?

Comment by Lorelei Halley Administrator on January 27, 2012 at 4:10pm

Fascinating.

Comment by Paula Harten on January 27, 2012 at 3:22pm

Actually the" hole with a cross: is made with 10 prs (white,white,red,white, white on each side) coming in and 10 prs going out.  The first and fifth pairs on each side form the sides of a box.  The center pairs (white and red) are plaited and crossed with a windmill crossing and the fourth pair on each side comes in, cuts off the corner and leaves, making the box appear rounded.   No pins are used at all.  I agree it gives the look of 4 honeycomb rings, but it is really less complicated and there is no gimp.

The "open hole" is more complicated because the five pairs coming from each side start with the first and second pairs from each side switching sides (through each other), then the third, fourth and (red) fifth pairs are brought through the first pairs that are continuing diagonally to the next hole. These incoming pairs are woven into a bundle before the third, fifth and second pairs are dropped off in sequence, thinning the bundles to a single pair on each side to join and form the bottom of the hole.  Working 10 pairs into a honeycomb would not recreate what I see in this detail of the Spiro lace.  

Yes, I found a page with images of Kortelahti's patterns and can see that she had, indeed done something like this, but with only 3 pairs coming from each side. A simple plait  would suffice to keep the first two pairs together and the third pair bounces of the plait in the middle of the sides.  I was hoping that was what I was seeing in the Spiro lace, but it really is not.  

As I said in the article, I am not suggesting that the pre-Columbian lace was the ancestor of our modern lace, but that things were learned, done and lost.

Comment by Lorelei Halley Administrator on January 27, 2012 at 1:24pm

Those are good close-ups Paula.  The group of 4 looks like the outer holes are like honeycomb rings in point ground, but worked in torchon ground.  The large single hole  look like 8 pin honeycomb rings.  Kortelahti also uses something similar in one of her new grounds.

Comment by Paula Harten on January 27, 2012 at 1:06am

I made a bookmark using the holes.  Are these images close enough? hole with cross and open hole  The colors spoil the design, but do show the progression of the threads.

Comment by Paula Harten on January 26, 2012 at 5:43pm

Now for the Pre-Columbian lace from Spiro, OK.  This image Imaging Spiro lace  shows the whole artifact in its plexiglass case.  Unfortunately, someone had glued the lace to a backing before they were able to preserve many of the artifacts.

The next photo Locating microscope images shows the process I had to go through to organize some of the best images.  It would have been better to set up a grid and be systematic about taking the photos and microscope images.  this lace is in the Sam Noble Oklahoma Museum of Natural History, Norman, OK.

I used the Nikon DSLR to get close images of various areas of the lace.  It was not easy to get good images through the plexiglass. This one shows the relationship of all the elements in the lace: the ground, open holes, twined band and holes with a cross.  Note the 5 pairs entering the holes from R and L and two ground pairs passing between the holes.  The ground pairs pass through the twined band.  Note the hole with a cross closest to the band is actually started above the band.

The microscope image here Corner of large hole shows an upper right side of a large hole where five pairs come together and then begin leaving, one at a time, along the side.

I made many versions in my attempt to recreate what I saw in the photos, using a bobbin lace pillow and bobbins.  This is one Recreation of Spiro lace that is not exactly right ( I took a pair out before bringing in all 5 on the right) but it is the way I would have done it if I had been them☺

One last picture for those of you who do not gat the bulletin - Spiro lace recreation in red  The historical textile specialists say the textiles were colorful and red was one of the colors.

This lace is, unarguably, not beautiful, but it is moderately complex.  In any case, it is a piece of history most of us had never seen or heard about.

Comment by Lorelei Halley Administrator on January 26, 2012 at 5:31pm

You got the link function to work exactly right, Paula.

 
 
 

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HOW THE SOFTWARE WORKS

Created by Lorelei Halley Administrator Jan 19, 2012 at 7:07pm. Last updated by Lorelei Halley Administrator Dec 9, 2014.

PHOTOS

Created by Lorelei Halley Administrator Jan 19, 2012 at 7:29pm. Last updated by Lorelei Halley Administrator Sep 2, 2014.

How to Post a Long Article

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